Cannon crews - yes or no?

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Privateer, Jul 6, 2015.

?

Do you want cannon crews?

  1. Yes!

    79.2%
  2. No!

    15.8%
  3. Indifferent

    5.0%
  1. Field Marshall

    Field Marshall Active Member

    I wouldn't call it laziness really. All we are doing is speculating. We haven't actually tried the gameplay to see if it has some logical value or meaning. While I agree that it would be better if it had some sort of animation like the ones in Age of Empires 3 I cannot fully judge this choice until I try the game. Cossacks 1 games are great games fro 15 years ago, but truly for a modern game they are horrible games, painful to play when you have played other newer strategy games. The only thing that keeps it alive is the actual game concept. It was a good RTS concept and that's what we are all here for, to see the good RTS concept be brought back to life(although some of us might not even care if they get the same old game). I really need to experience gameplay to judge such choices.
     
  2. The_Hussar

    The_Hussar Member

    Yes, I think there should be killable crew like in C2 but replenishing cannon crew with line infantry or cavalry seems odd to me. There should be a seperate trainable unit for this.

    I know devs want to stick with C1 as much as possible because it was a sale success but I don't think they have to repeat the flaws of the original. There should be some development for 15 years, come on!
     
  3. Nowy

    Nowy Well-Known Member

    Why not? Infantrymen even peasants can replenishing killed cannon crew. That was not hard thing and was historically accurate.
     
  4. Foeurdr

    Foeurdr Moderator Staff Member

    A cannon crew require a specialist it's not like the first guy you took could fire a cannon corectly, otherwise you just ask the cannon to explode or fire randomly.
     
  5. Field Marshall

    Field Marshall Active Member

    That's why I was expecting at least one artillery officer taking care of the cannons, but it seems that was just a unit placed there for decoration.
     
  6. Nowy

    Nowy Well-Known Member

    Of course cannon requied specialist, but manning cannon was not hard case. Infantrymen can do it.
    They knew well what for were gun powder and cannon projectiles and how they were loaded and fired.
    Specialist were only better skilled in specific duties, however these duties were not so hard to learnt.

    So, it would be fine include in the game cannon crew which could be replenishing with infantrymen or peasants.
     
  7. Field Marshall

    Field Marshall Active Member

    Yes' but I think a bigger problem will still be that the cannons move by themselves. So have realistic reloading but extremely unrealistic movement? I don't think that would be very nice.
     
  8. Daddio

    Daddio Moderator Staff Member

    Well Cannon animations have progressed a great deal over the years since C1 first came out.

    Should be a pretty simple mod if nothing else. We could even copy the animations from GSC games already out.

    Modder could be pretty active over the next year.
     
  9. Foeurdr

    Foeurdr Moderator Staff Member

    It's not like to fire a cannon you just need to put powder and the cannon ball and then light the fuse. So I'm still for a specialised troop to man them.

    Modder + GSC I think we will see amazing things done !
     
  10. Field Marshall

    Field Marshall Active Member

    This could be a good thing if the tools are good enough. We will see.
     
  11. Nowy

    Nowy Well-Known Member

    What more was needed there?
    Believe me, there were lot of cases when infantrymen or peasants, or other men replenished cannons crews quite well at that period. Manning cnnons was not top secret or very, very specialised duty. Of course specialised troops could did their duties better or smarter, but that did not mean that other men can not manned cannons at that times.
     
  12. The_Hussar

    The_Hussar Member

    I agree but there were officers to aim the cannons and give orders what type of ammo to charge the guns with. Calculating trajectory of the cannonballs is not a peasant's work. May be if the cannon is manned by speciliased troops it will reload faster and it would be more accurate than with a random crew. This would be a nice feature although I doubt there will be any crew in the vanilla. I hope it could be modded though.
     
  13. Nowy

    Nowy Well-Known Member

    There were mainly solid shots and canister shots. Aiming and calculating trajectory was not so necessary there.
    Artillery from that era was very inaccurate, especially at long range. Therefore random men could replenishing crews.
    They quickly lernt basic duties there. That was enough to fire and reload cannons.
     
  14. The_Hussar

    The_Hussar Member

    I agree the cannons were quite inaccurate and random soldiers could do reloading and firing but aiming was necessary. I don't think any sane commander would give the most devastating tol in the army in the hands of a bunch of peasants without proper officer control. Artillery pieces were quite expensive and few so I don't think any commander would leave them to be used poorly. I think there should be a speacial unit, like an officer. I think it would be much useful for an artillery formation as you proposed.
     
  15. Snuffy

    Snuffy Active Member

    Regarding cannon crews, I would like to see them but, I would like to see them as individuals and not a collective unit. If a crew member takes more damage than his companions to the point of causing his death, then show him as a casualty by the gun, and reduce the effectiveness of the cannon, in rate of fire, not necessarily its range or destructiveness.
     
  16. Nowy

    Nowy Well-Known Member

    If commander had not skilled artillerymen enough, he took whatever he can, even peasants without a doubt.
    Cannons were dangerous and expensive weapons, they can not stay uselessly without any crews.

    Please read some history books when during sieges, raw townsmen or random men manned cannons many times well.

    Aiming cannons was not hard thing, becouse there were not so complicate aiming instruments.
    Cannons fired with flat trajectory effectively only at relatively short range 800-1000 m.

    Main problem was how many gun powder they put into barrel, what projectile and how they elevate this barrel.
    That is all what artillerymen can do at that period.
     
  17. Field Marshall

    Field Marshall Active Member

    The problem wouldn't be using a peasant to attend the cannons. The problem would be who will be moving the cannon. I simply don't care if the cannon is reloaded by someone or not when there is something many times more unrealistic which is that the cannons move by themselves. Can't have cannons magically moving. This is not only in history books but everywhere. If you are not gonna have anyone moving the cannons then just leave them as magical beings that move by themselves and reload themselves.
     
    condor_fly likes this.
  18. Snuffy

    Snuffy Active Member

    Agreed F.M. Even AOE and A.C.D.N. had horse teams, and both had caissons for the trail of the gun instead of just hooking to the horse team harness.
     
  19. The_Hussar

    The_Hussar Member

    I wish to have cannon crew like in C2, may be with some special recruitable unit - a gunner; or if we have engineers ( I really hope we will have them ) they can also man the cannon making it a bit more accurate. Engineers can build faster than peasants and only they can start building special fortresses, defensive structures like sand bags, chevaux-de-fris,ect; they also may have grenades.
     
  20. kozak

    kozak New Member

    Its 2015, so simply speaking cannon crew is must. Just look at votes ratio.
     
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