Ranked Fire

Discussion in 'Modding' started by Ftoomsh, Oct 31, 2019.

  1. Ftoomsh

    Ftoomsh Well-Known Member

    Ranked musket fire and the associated issue of preventing muskets firing through friendlies has long been an obsession of mine for C3. Has anyone done recent work on this?

    Over 12 months ago I experimented with trying to prevent muskets firing through friendlies (easy enough) but also allowing up to three ranks but no more to fire near simultaneous volleys if need be. This proved harder. I managed to kludge a situation where the muskets in essence could fire through just over friendly heads close but still not through friendly bodies further away. The best I could do with this kludge was make the front rank fire (obviously), the second rank mostly fire and the third rank fire very sporadically until friendlies died in front. On a forward slope they did better than this and on a reverse slope worse than this. This was sort of okay. I achieved this by playing with shot height origin point. The troops were in essence shooting from about a head higher than the top of their heads (IIRC), but with the shot puffs being left where they should be and visible simulated musket projectiles NOT being used, the visuals of this were fine. I hope I can still find that code.

    However, I now wonder if there maybe is a better way. Why not add a calculation to permit muskets to fire through up to two friendlies but no more? Three rank formations could all fire straight ahead but more ranks could not fire ahead. These kludged physics would encourage line tactics and render death-balls and death-columns of muskets much less useful. Flanking tactics, especially with cavalry would be much more useful.

    I'd love to hear from people who have thought about or experimented with this issue in C3. I've come round to thinking that it doesn't matter what one does in the script code so long as the viewed experience and tactical/strategic play look and feel right to the player who wants a bit of a realism mod.
    Loner likes this.
  2. Foeurdr

    Foeurdr Moderator Staff Member

    I don't remember something for unit in formation to shoot in such a way.

    What may interest you is something Awar made in State vs Country. It's about palissade wall and units shooting through so maybe it's not revelant since it work with a building.
    In this mod if you select one option at the start of the game units can't fire through buildings and that also the case for palissade unless they meet a condition, shooters are able to shoot through friendly palisade if they are close enough to it.

    So maybe for units you could disallow firing if there is an ally in front except if the unit in question is in a distance of three or less ranks deep.
    You won't be able to model friendly fire this way, but at least you could in some way make positioning more strategical. That said I don't know if it work for unit !
  3. Ftoomsh

    Ftoomsh Well-Known Member

    The last time I was experimenting with this (over a year ago) I managed to to get units (in effect) to fire over the heads of the rank in front even with "no shooting through friendlies" set for the musket weapon. But they wouldn't fire through other friendlies further down range. Third rank wouldn't fire much either as their shot "ray" would have "hit" the first rank which invokes the "no fire through friendlies" rule. But I can't find the correct variable again and I have lost the precise code and notes. Darn, but I will keep looking. What this involves is having "no fire through friendly units (forget buildings)" set for the standard musket shot weapon which really operates like a "ray", not a flying ball. I lift the vertical start point of the shot by a value sufficient to get it above the head of the unit in front. Because the ray then angles down-range it heads towards the middle of the enemy box (I assume) so it still hits enemy. The user never sees that the start point of the shot is lifted as there is no projectile to see in flight and the shot puff is not lifted.

    The palisade trick sounds neat. I will have to see how they do that. That will help with shooting through palisades (which my method can't do) but it won't solve my "not firing from 2nd and 3rd ranks" issue which occurs when "no fire through friendlies" is set without adjustment in the vertical axis. Obviously when "no fire though friendlies" is set without changing anything else, then only the front rank of a formation will fire. I want 3 ranks to fire but no more. This would encourage correct line tactics when firepower is upgraded and/or musket unit numbers are high.
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