Discussion in 'Modding' started by Original-Cossacks-Player, Nov 23, 2016.
If you wanf to see that in action search for American Conquest Fortifications mod on YouTube.
I think I may have played this mod a long time ago? Was great fun! Such a shame American Conquest didn't get the finishing touches to make it a 10/10 (I give it a 9/10 simply because bugs and balance issues existed). If GSC can get American Conquest 2 going (I think they are working on it now, but that's just a hunch) and get the balance right and iron out any bugs I think the game will take off better than the original, keeping in mind we have a whole new generation who have never even heard of American Conquest, these kids weren't even born when this game came out, if GSC can tap into this market then the sky's the limit.
The American Conquest palette is beautiful, would have to be the best graphics of any 2D game of that 2000+ period, the scenery and animations are spectacular, and they did a good job with the scale of units vs. buildings.
American Conquest was a legend and Fortification mod too.
C2 had a better system also, Trees afforded protection from cannons, swamps and water would kill the fuses on cannon balls causing them not to explode.
They had crews that could be killed, rendering the cannons inoperable, causing you to re-crew in order to continue firing. Also they had caissons for quick movement from place to place. (Although the animation of this was flawed depending the amount of flat ground you had available.)
The only reason I could never get into Cossacks 2 was because they took away micro management, I love being in control of every aspect of the game whether it be resources, upgrades, defenses and units, most people will think that is absurd because the shy away from micro management and just want to get into the battle side of the game.
Original-cossacks player , you are right, but We could see different units in this game, different stables, different fortifications, barracks and etc. road systems, villages. cities, real people(women and men), trading system between the villages,different soldier types( military engineer, light infantry, heavy cavalry types,light infantry types, guard regiments), artillery types(rocket artillery etc) with crew and caissons. When viewed from this aspect, Cossacks 2 good game too. But We couldn't control all the game. Mining was very important Cossacks series, but in this game villages were producing mine when controlled these villages you had mine you didn't you had not mine. If your enemy controlled all mining villages and other village which was producing other resource (stone, wood and food) You had no chance to win. And also When your soldier used road system if your enemy blocked these roads with log cabin, castle or other defensive structures, you had to deal with many casualties. Only one nation has own mill( Russia).It was so annoying. Battle For Europe type multiplayer map style was also good. I sit on the fence now)
You are joking right? Much more micro in C2 than C1?
Yeahh probably since cossacks 3 is very arcade and unrealistic but sexy. American conwuest gonna be realistic one. I dont mind AQ 2 if it could be something different. Have more dynamic gameplay merged. Cossacks arcade with realism. In AQ i hated how few european soldiers there were. Ofc fhey had to work lots with indians. But European foot soldiers just fusiliers?? And... French fusilier had 9 bayonet power while US had 60+?? . If we check movies , read books , watch historical documentary or play empire total war. Theres so many regiments diffefent soldiers , colours... for example in AQ brit ons didn't had any highlanders wtf? What tov talk about musketeers and stuff... sighs* . Anyways maybe devs will share moding tools so modders gonna crack the shell out and gonna see whether is it possible to add some fun mechanics within a game. btw u remember cossacks beta vifeo? Theres fire of cannons is different then one withina game.
In respect to the "towns" that featured in Cossacks 2, then yes, I'm guessing you are referring to battlefield management and things such as replenishing cannon crews?
If the devs had done what I had expected them to do, i.e. incorporate visual and gameplay features of the later games in the series as well as making it "3D" we wouldn't be having some of the discussions we seem to be having.
Oh yes then you are correct. the economy is much more simplified in C2. The emphasis in C2 is the battle system.
C3 I would estimate is 80% economy, 20% battle.
C2 would be the total opposite. 20% economy, 80% battle, and map control. (And a 100% more realistic as far as battle effects, and troop selections)
You can't always get what you want .....................
Agreed, but I don't see what's stopping them from making American Conquest 2 and a Cossacks 2 inspire DLC for 3.
We have another date looming one year from the date of original release. I am reading between the lines that this is the end of the contractual obligations of the devs. THAT is going to be interesting as to whether or not the current dev team will be further involved in any new development.
That's what I'm hoping for as well.
Well I am not sure that the C3 engine is capable of the complexity of a AC, or C2 type game. It appears that it would be a complete rebuild of the engine and code? Or in other words a completely new game and engine?
Not a modder or game designer of course, but I get this from others who are. It is all over my head.
But if it is possible with the current engine, Why don't those who can mod it? It likely would come out faster, and perhaps even better if it was done in a mod?
Well from my personal experience and from what I've heard people said that it's possible.
Plus the original Cossacks and American Conquest engines weren't that different to each other.
Of course, Cossacks was based on the first version of it's engine while American Conquest was based on it's second version. Cossacks 2 was based on the 3rd version and so forth. But those version were just merely modifications of the first, meaning that it's entirely possible to have minimal modification to the Cossacks 3 engine in order for it to become American Conquest 2.
So from a modding standpoint I am not 100% sure but I think someone said that morale was sort of possible with extensive modification from modders, while building garrison is already possible without much modification, think of it as something that's already in the game because of the mines and transport ships.
But other problems such as animations, models and textures still remain, the creation of these is a very lengthy and complex process which few people are able to do in our small modding community.
So in the end, yes, I do believe that American Conquest 2 could be made as a modification for Cossacks 3, however, the amount of time and effort it would need to be done would not be worth it, especially when it's done for free.
So a better alternative to me and many others is for GSC to make it a standalone game or as a sort of DLC for Cossacks 3 and be done with it.
If they go the DLC route that would mean that Cossacks 3 would become a platform which could be expanded through time and cover a large portion of history, from the 17th century or earlier if there is demand or they so wish all the way up to World War 1 possibly since these DLC expansions would introduce new mechanics to the game and new parts of history such as the American Revolutionary War and the 7 Years War period, the Napoleonic Wars, the American Civil War, the Franco-Prussian war and so forth.
Edit: Just wanted to point out that it would probably be cheaper to go the DLC expansion route and it wouldn't devide the already small community the game has.
It would be great if what you propose here would happen. And I would support it 100%. Who knows it could already be in process. since as you say it would be a lengthy process to change the engine in order to make the changes to mimic AC. and many of the developers like Ferox, and Atem have moved on to other projects.
But a remaster of AC, or even C2, I would guess would not be in the works. Both games had a faithful, but small following. While C1 had a huge following. Getting people excited about a remaster of ether game would not carry as much hype as C1 did. RTS in general has fallen out of favor to a large degree.
I would think they should step up to a completely different game, instead of a remaster, but do a continuation of both. Building old games that look better, works for only a short run. I like C3, and will play it for many more years. But give me a continuation of C2, and I will play it forever.
I would not worry about the C3 community, it has already shrunk a lot since the launch. I think it has stabilized for the most part. Some will leave some will join. But there is just not enough there to attract a modern gamer.
We need a modern Cossacks game. With realistic battle simulations, and Nations.
Observation based upon game numbers next to a player's name indicating the issuance of the license, there are about 89,000 or less copies of the game sold.
The number of people playing mods is significantly less, probably no more than 1000 or so.
I am reasonably sure that a modder or a team of modders can eventually put out a product. From what I understand, that will be a long way off and require countless man hours (woman hours) of work.
I don't mind paying for a stand alone product made by the developers. I DO mind the lack of foresight on the part of the devs and marketer of the game and the total disregard for the work and time put into this product by the modders.
Again, an observation- when I see a mod having been made and constantly updated for improvement by the efforts of a very few modders and then mysteriously, the vanilla game is frequently patched to incorporate the modded products into the official version of the game, I can only surmise that GSC and its developers poaching on the work done by others. It is tedious and time consuming work done to test even one change for one unit for one country to see the effect during gameplay. If the change has unexpected consequences, it needs to be scrapped and alternatives examined. I hold out little hope that a game as discussed most recently in this thread is going to be put out by GSC for many, many years.
I share your scepticism, but will not loose hope that something else will be coming.
They have stated from the very beginning of all this that C3 was only the beginning, with much more, and better games to come from the cossacks series.
My fear is that i won't live long enough to see it!
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